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#21 Azoth

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Posted 29 January 2012 - 08:17 PM

We all know about Overgrowth. We watch it with excitement. Get pumped for Mirror's Edge 2. FROSTBITE ENGINE


I thought Mirror's Edge 2 was cancelled? Is it back in progress again?

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#22 Trotsky

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Posted 30 January 2012 - 02:07 AM

Platformers and adventure games making a comeback without becoming third party garbage shovelware like they did a decade ago.

I'm getting sick of "story-driven" games. For a developer to even suggest their game is going to have a large focus on story is an insult. I enjoy a good story as much as anybody else but it shouldn't be a "focus." If you need a good story to read try a book, they are much much better for that purpose. I play video GAMES to enjoy GAMEPLAY not to hear the sob story of some blockhead and his daughter/wife/mother/pet/gay alien buttbuddy.
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#23 Freeloh

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Posted 30 January 2012 - 03:13 AM

Platformers and adventure games making a comeback without becoming third party garbage shovelware like they did a decade ago.

I'm getting sick of "story-driven" games. For a developer to even suggest their game is going to have a large focus on story is an insult. I enjoy a good story as much as anybody else but it shouldn't be a "focus." If you need a good story to read try a book, they are much much better for that purpose. I play video GAMES to enjoy GAMEPLAY not to hear the sob story of some blockhead and his daughter/wife/mother/pet/gay alien buttbuddy.

Platformers? Super Meat Boy? VVVVVV? Any of the recent Mario games? Or recent Kirby games? Rayman Origins? Mirror's Edge?
Adventure? Zelda? Beyond Good and Evil? Brutal Legend?
My point is that they are still around, in full force, and pretty damn good. You just have to look. Still, I do agree that they need to get "big" again, but they're far from diminished.
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#24 Xero

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Posted 30 January 2012 - 04:15 AM

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I'm getting sick of "story-driven" games. For a developer to even suggest their game is going to have a large focus on story is an insult. I enjoy a good story as much as anybody else but it shouldn't be a "focus." If you need a good story to read try a book, they are much much better for that purpose. I play video GAMES to enjoy GAMEPLAY not to hear the sob story of some blockhead and his daughter/wife/mother/pet/gay alien buttbuddy.


That might be one of the most ignorant things I've ever read.


#25 Stylus

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Posted 30 January 2012 - 07:42 AM

More indie games that actually bring something new to the table pushing out all of the brown shooters that plague the market.
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#26 Michaelangelo

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Posted 30 January 2012 - 08:24 AM

Platformers and adventure games making a comeback without becoming third party garbage shovelware like they did a decade ago.

I'm getting sick of "story-driven" games. For a developer to even suggest their game is going to have a large focus on story is an insult. I enjoy a good story as much as anybody else but it shouldn't be a "focus." If you need a good story to read try a book, they are much much better for that purpose. I play video GAMES to enjoy GAMEPLAY not to hear the sob story of some blockhead and his daughter/wife/mother/pet/gay alien buttbuddy.

>mfw you're such a vidya game hipster
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Trotsky, I do believe you're missing the point. Story-driven games in my personal opinion must make use OF the story within the gameplay. I dunno what you're playing. :P

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#27 Tyrannical Tim

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Posted 30 January 2012 - 09:03 AM

Honestly, I've had the most fun in games that never had any focus on story line.

Sometimes I just want something where I can mess around and have fun with fast paced action, create my own world, or do whatever.
Like for instance, BF2. No story. Just Multiplayer, but still some of the best fun I've had in my gaming experience.

Same goes for just about every Nintendo game of my Childhood.

Mario is a good example. Dude has to save girl friend from bad guy.
Doesn't get much more simple and yet so entertaining than that.

Edit: Oh snap, I forgot about TF2! Best thing out there, and doesn't require any story to it. But they do have it, not a lot, but only a little. And only if you search for it.

Edited by Tyrannical Tim, 30 January 2012 - 09:06 AM.

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#28 Trotsky

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Posted 30 January 2012 - 10:04 AM

Platformers? Super Meat Boy? VVVVVV? Any of the recent Mario games? Or recent Kirby games? Rayman Origins? Mirror's Edge?
Adventure? Zelda? Beyond Good and Evil? Brutal Legend?
My point is that they are still around, in full force, and pretty damn good. You just have to look. Still, I do agree that they need to get "big" again, but they're far from diminished.


Yeah, more like those. Except made more frequently TODAY instead of brown n bloom shooter #10000
I didn't say indie hardcore retro platformers. I mean platformers that still change with the ebb and flow of the market like they were years ago, innovating and such.

That might be one of the most ignorant things I've ever read.


I'm going to assume one of two things: your dumb self is just confused and didn't think I meant that games should have no plot, lore or backstory whatsoever. Or you are really telling me games like Heavy Rain or other visual novel quicktime events are perfectly acceptable and should be continued with people such as Hamburger Helper at the reigns of such an industry. In which case I will truly stop humoring your intelligence.

>mfw you're such a vidya game hipster


Yes sir you trolled me. Trolled me good.
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#29 Michaelangelo

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Posted 30 January 2012 - 10:34 AM

Yes sir you trolled me. Trolled me good.

I wasn't trolling, you just made me laugh. :P

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#30 Ocelot

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Posted 30 January 2012 - 11:18 AM

They should absolutely make more games like Heavy Rain.

Heavy Rain is a deeply, deeply flawed game, there's no denying that. If you think about the story beyond face value it just falls apart completely, and a lot of the animation and voice acting is terrible, and some of the control is way too far down the pretension path. But the concept some people have of it just being one long QTE is just plain wrong. For the most part it's only difference from a regular story-driven third-person game is that you don't have to stop every ten minutes to shoot a dozen guys in the face. That game's main problem is that it tries to be different for the sake of being different.

There's a part in the game where you play as a Private Detective on a case. You go and see this woman who you think might provide some leads, but when you knock at the door nobody answers. You peer in through the windows, walk around the side of the house to the back door and knock again. You hear a baby crying and the sound of overflowing water, and you kick the door open to find the lady trying to kill herself in the bathtub. After fishing her out, bandaging her wounds and taking care of the baby you eventually get to talk to her and ask her about what you went there for. It's one chapter of the game I found really memorable because I was doing something completely unlike any other game I'd played, something that would just have been a cutscene in most games, yet the method by which I actually played it made me feel like I was actually doing that thing. And I'm not talking about some kind of artsy fartsy "Oh man, it like toootally changed my whole perspective, maaan" nonsense, I'm talking about the same sense of satisfaction you get from solving a puzzle in an old adventure game. OK, so all I did was open my inventory and click on the piece of paper and then the bottom of the door, and then click on the screwdriver and the lock, and then use the Hand icon on the paper again and then collected the key, but when you boil any game down to the basics like that you always get back to being just a guy sitting down with a controller in your hand pressing buttons.

The difference with Heavy Rain is that the puzzles are real world things that you don't need to get into the mind of some random Lucasarts employee to figure out the logic behind. You see a lady with her wrists sliced and you think "OH ****... uh uh uh... Medicine Cabinet! Bandages! Don't die lady I'll be right back!" and then you save the day and you feel awesome. Those kinds of intuitive puzzles are a rarity in the adventure game world, but I was doing that kind of thing all the way through Heavy Rain, and that's what made that game great. It puts you in situations completely unlike regular video game moments and for the most part leaves you to figure your way out, and you usually do because the game is designed so cleverly that almost every situation can be resolved multiple ways. And the game will branch differently depending on how things go, there's never a Game Over Try Again screen. Every playthrough turns out differently, and often in pretty meaningful ways. People always complain that RPGs with multiple endings boil down to a conversation choice five minutes from the end and then a different cutscene, and they ignore Heavy Rain with its twenty something different endings that can branch off at pretty much any point throughout the game.

So, yeah, a lot of the magic is hidden behind needlessly obtuse inputs. Twirling the stick to wrap the bandages around the suicide lady's wrists, but twirling it gently, doesn't really add a whole lot to the game. Having to perform the action on screen with your right analogue stick instead of just having a dedicated action button isn't that exciting, and some of the choices are just downright dumb. To move your character around you have to hold the R2 button to start walking and then steer with the left stick; why not just use the left stick like every other game ever? And when you get to a conversation your choices of answers are mapped to face buttons that fly around in circles on the screen so you can rarely pick the one you want. It's dumb. They're the kind of decisions that are made just to make a game seem different; they'd be ironed out of the design process a few games down the line. When you look at how much that team learnt between Fahrenheit and Heavy Rain you'd be amazed. Unfortunately it's a slow process because Quantic Dream are the only developer out there making this kind of game. Team Bondi did something similar with L.A. Noire; both games are modern-takes on the oldschool adventure game, and each has its own strongpoints. And, yes, each has its own weakpoints. A lot of them, in some cases. Really big ones. But to just write them off because you have to press buttons that are displayed on screen instead of learning what the buttons do at the start of the game and then pressing them without being prompted is silliness.

#31 880_ZERO

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Posted 30 January 2012 - 11:41 AM

Bring back games that played like Halo 2. Why? It was the pioneer of internet video gaming on a console and was just brilliant. It was the most popular Xbox Live game until it was shut down for a reason.


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#32 Xero

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Posted 30 January 2012 - 12:55 PM

I'm going to assume one of two things: your dumb self is just confused and didn't think I meant that games should have no plot, lore or backstory whatsoever. Or you are really telling me games like Heavy Rain or other visual novel quicktime events are perfectly acceptable and should be continued with people such as Hamburger Helper at the reigns of such an industry. In which case I will truly stop humoring your intelligence.


I said neither of those things. You said that story shouldn't be a focus, and I called that ignorant. Your dumb self seems to be jumping to self-made conclusions. Did I say that visual novel quicktime events should be helming the industry? No. Gameplay and story go hand in hand.


#33 Risk

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Posted 30 January 2012 - 06:01 PM

Trotsky is a drunken tiger when it comes to his opinions. Don't hold any attention to him - he communicates... differently.

Anyways, I want a fast, arcade-y first person shooter, something along the lines of Unreal Tournament (or just a new UT).

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#34 Tyrannical Tim

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Posted 30 January 2012 - 09:43 PM

Some people don't have time for a massive story plotline. Others are usually just too tired from work/school or a combination of both to even bother with story.

Some people just want to have something fast paced with action, or something that requires limited thought other than button mashing.
Not every game has to have a massive story that's great and changes the genre. I'd rather the gameplay was solid, and re-playable, over a great story.
You can't reread a story and have it be the same once you know how things are gonna turn out.
Gameplay on the other hand, can be different every time.

I pay for gameplay, not a book.
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#35 The Captain

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Posted 30 January 2012 - 10:04 PM

Oh God the double-standards in here reek. Come on guys, I'm sure we can all open our minds just a little and see where we're each coming from. It won't hurt. I promise.

Anyways, while I don't entirely agree, I do see where Trotsky and Tim are coming from (Especially with the amount of recent games claiming to be story-based but turning out to be complete rubbish instead, though that might be a rather broad generalization.). I mean, TF2 is living proof of a game based around mechanics/design versus story, considering it hardly has one and it was slowly molded on over time. Other examples would, of course, be things like the old Marios, Worms, etc. I certainly wouldn't mind more games like that; it's nice to have a nice solid change of pace every once in a while where it's completely focused on innovative gameplay vs. story telling. The obvious exceptions here are games with stellar/immersive stories that also combine entertaining gameplay. But while it'd be nice to have some plug-n-play innovative shooter, I don't think it can get much higher than the current standard (Monday Night Combat being the most recent example of a flat-faced attempt at pure-gameplay-no-story).

Don't get me wrong I love games with good stories, but it wouldn't kill anyone if there was the odd game that lacked one and had brilliant gameplay, surely? Sorry for being human but I kinda like to just crash with something mindless after a long, hard day sometimes. I mean, keep good story-driven games coming, but an increase in innovative gameplay that exists purely for play wouldn't be half-bad (Dare I say even preferable?)

Edited by Le Capitaine, 30 January 2012 - 10:10 PM.

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#36 Trotsky

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Posted 30 January 2012 - 10:26 PM

I said neither of those things. You said that story shouldn't be a focus, and I called that ignorant. Your dumb self seems to be jumping to self-made conclusions. Did I say that visual novel quicktime events should be helming the industry? No. Gameplay and story go hand in hand.


You called me ignorant and left it at that, fool, so whatever nonsense you have going through your thick skull I can't quite discern. But I was correct in my clairvoyance; you seem to think I am saying story is a terrible thing and should be ignored. A thought I erased any sort of notion of in the post you just quoted. So basically I said the same thing you are seemingly saying here:

Did I say that visual novel quicktime events should be helming the industry? No. Gameplay and story go hand in hand.


Then I think you miss what a "story-driven" game is. Which is a game that focuses on story more than gameplay, which is a ridiculous thing to do if you want to make video games. I don't mind calling them something else like Katawa Shouju is a visual novel, but people who label them "video games" are delusional.

Jumping to conclusions? Then what did you assume I meant in the first place? Clearly something that wasn't correct. I guess you jumped to conclusions too. Even after I clearly said otherwise here:

your dumb self is just confused and didn't think I meant that games should have no plot, lore or backstory whatsoever.


But of course you had to start a shit-flinging contest. And now frankly I don't know why you continued to pursue it.

And using my own insult in a feeble attempt to retaliate? I'd say you have as much creativity as people in the industry these days.
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#37 Tyrannical Tim

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Posted 30 January 2012 - 10:42 PM

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#38 Xero

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Posted 30 January 2012 - 11:09 PM

UMADBROLOL


Yeah, whatever. I'm done. It's obvious that you think anyone that doesn't agree with you is inherently wrong. Insult me all you wish, I ain't even mad.


#39 Goldy

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Posted 31 January 2012 - 12:23 AM

Both of you, Trotsky and Xero, are banned from the forums for a week to cool off. It doesn't matter who started it, both of you let yourselves get worked up about something that isn't important and instead of reporting it made it worse by arguing back.

Now move on...

#40 Klaykid

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Posted 31 January 2012 - 07:29 AM

I like run and gun, obscene humour, and genital jokes in Bulletstorm. Not many people liked it from what I heard, but I absolutely loved playing that game. I still continue to play it now. But I wished it had more as in content wise. I wish for a sequel but I know it will never happen.

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